CONNECT is the Saturday evening worship experience of Apple Valley Church of the Nazarene. We seek to grow as followers of Jesus by worshiping intimately, thinking deeply and responding appropriately. The purpose of this blog is to provide a place to view the messages taught at our worship experiences as well as provide material for personal devotions.
Blessings to all of you at AV-NAZ! I had the awesome pleasure of visiting the Church on Saturday nite, 7/10. We had a fantastic nite of Praise and Worship along with an in depth study of "Heaven" and how we should be living on earth if we are called "Believers". Pastor Paul has a very gracious way of connecting with all ages, from tweens to twilights! LOL! But heaven is a serious subject. We read in Revelation 21:8 and 22:15 there are those who will be without. We cannot continue to live in sin even after we have known God. Those that sin, lie, cheat, etc. will have no place in Heaven. So even if we believe in Jesus as our Savior, and we start drinking and partying and having illicit sex, and we are caught unaware, like a thief in the night He will come back. Do people really believe, that you can continue to sin and be saved?
Anonymous- I think that just may be one of the greatest misconceptions in America today: so many people think that he or she can continue to live in sin and still go to heaven, so long as he or she "believes in the bible", yet that is clearly contradictory to the scriptures... This is a very grievous and troubling thing, and I only wish that more people knew the truth of the bible, and the very real possibility of their own condemnation if they don't repent.
Two of the comments here mention that belief is not enough. I think this is Biblical. The problem I see is that we as Christians need to do a better job explaining that faith "belief" which saves is an active belief starting in repentance and continual spiritual growth and maturity. Let us also remember that all at at different places on the road of maturity!
The follow is a conversation between Pastor Paul and Nick Conlon on facebook
(Nick) 1. The reason there is sin and "bad" things around us now because we are fallen and have a sin nature. This will be restored in Heaven but what about free will? That is a major cause of our sin now. And if the answer is without our sin nature we will have no disure or temptation to resist God and hurt one another, doesn't that partially emliminate our free will?
Because if you look at it objectively, a person in a particular place who has no desire, then no capability, to go against what is right seems possible but would make them ignorant to choice and similar to just reacting to what is happening around them with limited choice. No free will. (I don't mean to sound harsh, I believe Heaven is perfect and frankly there is no way for man to comprehend it.)
Also I get that once someone is exposed to God they would never want to deny Him because of His love but does that mean someone can't decide to leave God? The video talked about being forced to be with someone and how that has no true meaning. Isn't the fact we can choose something other than God what makes our choosing Him so special. If the choice is taken away where does that leave us?
2. Sorry, I got carried away up there.
So Christianity places a huge emphasis on the fact our salvation is given not earned. But the video says our mansions will be filled with what we "earned"? What are the passages for that?
(Pastor Paul's response)
This is is the stuff I love, questions, thoughts and more questions!!!
1. Free will in heaven? Think of it this way. There is a time for making decisions and time for living with them. Life here is when we make the decision heaven or hell is where we live with the effects of the choice made in our life. The fact that heaven is without sin or temptation does not eliminate free will in fact I think that we will be more free to choose that which we truly desire (God) because the sin nature is gone. See the problem Paul talks about in Romans 7-8. This conflict of the soul is no longer when we arrive in heaven.
2. The emphasis on works or deeds is seen in may passages. I will give you a few. - Galatians 5:16-26 - 2 Corinthians 5:1-10 - 1 Corinthians 3:5-17 ("the Day" means day of judgement)
7 comments:
This week at CONNECT we will be studying Revelation 22:1-8. Watch this video and share your thoughts.
-Pastor Paul
I think this is very simply, yet clearly put. I can hardly wait...
Blessings to all of you at AV-NAZ! I had the awesome pleasure of visiting the Church on Saturday nite, 7/10. We had a fantastic nite of Praise and Worship along with an in depth study of "Heaven" and how we should be living on earth if we are called "Believers". Pastor Paul has a very gracious way of connecting with all ages, from tweens to twilights! LOL! But heaven is a serious subject. We read in Revelation 21:8 and 22:15 there are those who will be without. We cannot continue to live in sin even after we have known God. Those that sin, lie, cheat, etc. will have no place in Heaven. So even if we believe in Jesus as our Savior, and we start drinking and partying and having illicit sex, and we are caught unaware, like a thief in the night He will come back. Do people really believe, that you can continue to sin and be saved?
Anonymous- I think that just may be one of the greatest misconceptions in America today: so many people think that he or she can continue to live in sin and still go to heaven, so long as he or she "believes in the bible", yet that is clearly contradictory to the scriptures... This is a very grievous and troubling thing, and I only wish that more people knew the truth of the bible, and the very real possibility of their own condemnation if they don't repent.
Two of the comments here mention that belief is not enough. I think this is Biblical. The problem I see is that we as Christians need to do a better job explaining that faith "belief" which saves is an active belief starting in repentance and continual spiritual growth and maturity. Let us also remember that all at at different places on the road of maturity!
Pastor Paul
ahh yes very true
The follow is a conversation between Pastor Paul and Nick Conlon on facebook
(Nick)
1. The reason there is sin and "bad" things around us now because we are fallen and have a sin nature. This will be restored in Heaven but what about free will? That is a major cause of our sin now. And if the answer is without our sin nature we will have no disure or temptation to resist God and hurt one another, doesn't that partially emliminate our free will?
Because if you look at it objectively, a person in a particular place who has no desire, then no capability, to go against what is right seems possible but would make them ignorant to choice and similar to just reacting to what is happening around them with limited choice. No free will. (I don't mean to sound harsh, I believe Heaven is perfect and frankly there is no way for man to comprehend it.)
Also I get that once someone is exposed to God they would never want to deny Him because of His love but does that mean someone can't decide to leave God? The video talked about being forced to be with someone and how that has no true meaning. Isn't the fact we can choose something other than God what makes our choosing Him so special. If the choice is taken away where does that leave us?
2. Sorry, I got carried away up there.
So Christianity places a huge emphasis on the fact our salvation is given not earned. But the video says our mansions will be filled with what we "earned"? What are the passages for that?
(Pastor Paul's response)
This is is the stuff I love, questions, thoughts and more questions!!!
1. Free will in heaven? Think of it this way. There is a time for making decisions and time for living with them. Life here is when we make the decision heaven or hell is where we live with the effects of the choice made in our life. The fact that heaven is without sin or temptation does not eliminate free will in fact I think that we will be more free to choose that which we truly desire (God) because the sin nature is gone. See the problem Paul talks about in Romans 7-8. This conflict of the soul is no longer when we arrive in heaven.
2. The emphasis on works or deeds is seen in may passages. I will give you a few.
- Galatians 5:16-26
- 2 Corinthians 5:1-10
- 1 Corinthians 3:5-17 ("the Day" means day of judgement)
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